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tunna
Joined: 13 Oct 2004
Posts: 17
Location: Central UK
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Hi again ,not advertising for any gain!!!,but Techno Bots is if used correctly
is a brilliant place to pick up helpful tips, the Uk has gone through this learning curve, and what we have learned and where we have learned it from is free to all who wish to look,so dont understand your comments,
I could have said look at Paul Hills site which contains more Robot Combat
info than any other current site ,but doesnt say where to buy from,so the viewer is left to search again,I under stand that there is no dedicated Aussie Bot supplier, as of yet, and the world being a smaller place by the day, technobots is within reach for that bit of kit that may just be a little difficult to aquire out there, still if this type of help is not of use to you guys , it wont be mentioned again,
Bulldog Breed
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Wed May 18, 2005 5:03 pm |
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Spockie-Tech
Site Admin
Joined: 31 May 2004
Posts: 3160
Location: Melbourne, Australia
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I'm sure Tony is a great guy and I've heard good things about TechnoBots, so I have no problem with either of them, which is why I didnt say anything until the plug-factor got a bit too high..
I understand that "Supplier X" may well have already done the research about what works and what doesnt, so just advising someone to "buy all your stuff from X and you will have no trouble" might be good advice in their mind, but..
Most of us builder characters like to know the reasons *why* things do or dont work and gain an understanding of what they are doing - so saying "all you need to know is available on TechnoBots" is not true, the sum total of knowledge I can find regarding Gyro's on TechnoBots is..
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We now stock the very popular GWS gyro as used in many robots to help steer.
PG-03 Gyro
"A 7g piezo gyro just larger than a £1 coin. Suitable for use with Futaba, JR, Hi-tec, Sanwa, Multiplex systems. Fitted with JR/Futaba style plug. With the PC-3, you can remotely turn the gyro on/off.
PC-3 Gyro Switch
Just plug into an additional channel on your receiver and turn the gyro on / off via the transmitter. This is especially useful in robots as a gyro slows full body spins."
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So, 1 Model of Gyro, and 1 remote disarm switch for sale. No mention of anything about how they work, what they do, why you might need a disarm switch if your bot is invertible, or any tech info at all.. just a "this is what you need - buy this".. thats hardly everything you need to know..
Sorry to be bitchy about it, but if I wanted to just be told "This is what works, just buy it and be happy" then I probably wouldnt be into a hobby like Bot Building.. I enjoy the learning, not just being handed a solution for a price with no information about it. _________________ Great minds discuss ideas. Average minds discuss events. Small minds discuss people
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Thu May 19, 2005 11:18 am |
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tunna
Joined: 13 Oct 2004
Posts: 17
Location: Central UK
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Firstly I have to say that a gyro isnt the answer to all drive control problems,they work well, on machines that have been constructed with good balance, ie weight distributed well ,about the wheel positions, machines built this way can turn on a sixpence, but of course the gyro tries its best to stop this, so one answer is to fit a device in between
the gyro , receiver, and servo, if you use servos, that is, this device is very cheap to buy, works on a spare channel of the receiver, and you can turn on or off the gyro as required, hope this helps,
Bulldog Breed
ps you can also use this device on solid state controls,and they weigh only a few grammes
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Sun May 22, 2005 2:43 am |
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tunna
Joined: 13 Oct 2004
Posts: 17
Location: Central UK
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Hey Guys all this talk about gyros,reminds me of a long chat I had with the great George Francis, of Chaos 11 fame ,I asked him how difficult it was to drive Chaos without the gyro, and he said that it was a little (fitchy)
Ipswich speak for not very controllable!! but he gave me a good lesson
in the use of the trimmers, mounted in the back of my Futaba Skysport 6A
it made Bulldog a lot less fierce ,allowed me to be able to control the the obvious power we had on board ,we have two settings that are swichable 1-absolutly manic, and 2 more refined, both go through the Gyro ,
but in rate 1 the gyro is less noticable ,very usefull when you have a 100 kg spinner bearing down on you threatening to rip you to bits,
hope this helps (Bulldog Breed)
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Mon May 23, 2005 6:00 am |
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Spockie-Tech
Site Admin
Joined: 31 May 2004
Posts: 3160
Location: Melbourne, Australia
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We added a Gyro to "Scoopy Doo" and found it made a *huge* improvement in the driveability for Mel..
Scoopy being a 2WD bot, with the drive at the rear, and the front support points on the corners, what would often happen (imo) is that a slight irregularity on the floor going under a wheel would leave most of the weight sitting on the 3 level corners and the slightly elevated wheel would slip momentarily, causing her to veer off in one direction or another when trying to go straight.
Fast reactions on the stick with correcting tweaks were necessary to keep her going in a straight line.. something most drivers probably dont even realise they are doing if they are keeping up, but it all adds to the load of making her do what you want to and keeping on target.
Also, if you suddenly slammed the drive stick from still to full-forward, there would normally be a change-of-direction as well, as (most likely) one of the drive wheels slipped and spun slightly more than the other. Again this could be corrected for manually if you were really on the ball..
Adding the gyro took the responsibilities for these corrections off the driver, and caused her to "just go straight" in a much more reliable manner. You can suddenly go from still to a full speed cross-arena charge and expect that she will go straight without requiring any steering-drift correction inputs along the way.
Its a subtle difference in some cases since a skilled driver can probably overcome the lack of automatic correction using their own fast reflexes, (Rob tried a Gyro briefly in Reboot but didnt see much benefit at the time), but I'm convinced that to those who find that your 2WD bot doesnt just instinctively do what you want it to (as it does for a more experienced driver), that you will find a noticeable improvement..
I tried putting one in Inspector General, but realised it would need a remote-disable to prevent the gyro-death-spin when the bot became inverted, so had to take it out again at that time.
However, I have recently found and purchased a cheap ($12US) remote gyro disarm switch (yes tony, the same one TechnoBots stocks I found it from a hobby supplier in japan about a week before you mentioned them), that does the job I expected it would on the bench, so I.G. is most likely going to be Gyro-equipped too at the next Vic round..
Inspector General having the angle-grinder head and saw a long way away from the center of its balanced rotation point, gives it a significant amount of inertia when turning, and if its turning fast (which it can do very well as you've probably all noticed ), then I need to apply some "opposite stick" to halt the turn when its aimed in the direction I want, or else it over-shoots as the rotation rate gradually slows down.
Hopefully the gyro will improve this (at least while its right side up, inverted it will have to be disarmed), so I'm expecting to be able to aim that saw for your wheels with more precision in future.
So far, I quite like Gyro's, and although they do introduce more potential failure points, cost and complexity into your control system, I think unless you're a wizard on the control sticks who doesnt need to improve their driving at all (or have a 4WD bot, since they're inherently more directionally stable), then they're probably worthwhile trying.. _________________ Great minds discuss ideas. Average minds discuss events. Small minds discuss people
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Mon May 23, 2005 10:10 am |
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