www.robowars.org

RoboWars Australia Forum Index -> Technical Chat

C6 VFD conversion
Goto page 1, 2  Next

Post new topic   Reply to topic
  Author    Thread
Glen
Experienced Roboteer


Joined: 16 Jun 2004
Posts: 9481
Location: Where you least expect


 Reply with quote  
C6 VFD conversion

Here's something that might be of interest to some given there are a few c6 lathes kicking about. Fed up with the constant V belt slip ruining carbide inserts and the dodge-o-rama timing belt getting chewed up and making the slowest 3 speeds useless... To fix this the plan is to put a 3x more powerful motor in with a VFD to allow variable speed and a possible CNC conversion.

The conversion is going to be done in 2 stages. The first is to just throw it together roughly enough to make it work, where I can then machine the rest of the parts to finish everything 100%. Then the next stage will be to tidy up the installation, wiring etc.

Decided to go with a 1.5hp dual voltage 3 phase motor off ebay to replace the gutless 0.5hp single phase offering it came with. This is the place i got it from but they don't seem to sell them anymore.

http://stores.ebay.com.au/cononmotor/Three-phase-Motor-415v-/_i.html?_fsub=5221176018

Appears to be a common enough motor to obtain though. The type is "YX3-80M2-2BJ". This new motor is much bigger and needs quite a bit of butchering to make it fit in. But fit it does Smile

Anyone that's tried to remove the stock motor knows it is the biggest nightmare if the lathe is still bolted down to the stand. The two bolts beneath the motor are basically inaccessible and take ages to remove!

To fix that, two strips of 50mmx10mm flat bar get drilled to bolt to the motor and another 4x holes to bolt to the lathe, two of them are in a different position. I will ammend this post with the drawing for anyone that wants to do the swap the same way Smile



Next one has to drill a pair of new holes in the lathe itself. Don't worry too much about doing it by hand, every hole on every chinese machine is done that way haha.



The size and cooling fins on the new motor don't permit the use of the old set of holes to the left of the picture, thus the new ones which, as stated previously, allow them to be done up much easier. The top ones are tapped, the bottom two are through holes with a thread in the aluminium motor mount, they get done up via the gap between the lathe bed. Much easier to install!

All bolted up:



Annoyingly the bolts holding the motor together are 60 degrees off, requiring much drilling and chopping. I'll dremel them to a much nicer finish when i complete the rest of the install.




Pressed a cheap cast pulley on for the time being and ran the stock V belt and stock tensioner. Works well.



If the back piece is to be kept then it needs chopping as well to clear the motor. Two of the bolts on the motor termination box have to be replaced with countersunks to clear this piece too. It isn't really neccessary as it's just to hide the stock wiring which is no longer there, but it should stop swarf getting over the motor and i like to put tools up on it Razz



Here's a vid of the first run when it uploads. Much power!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AbawPFWXEsU&feature=youtu.be

Next I need to mount the vfd into the cabinet, complete the proper, safe wiring of the lot and remake the control panel to incorporate the new controls as well as a Tachometer readout. Also have to hunt down the proper timing belts and pulleys. Then i will be a very happy boy! Cool
_________________
www.demon50s.com - Minimoto parts
http://www.youtube.com/user/HyzerGlen - Videoooozzz

Post Sat Dec 20, 2014 8:15 pm 
 View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website MSN Messenger
Nick
Experienced Roboteer


Joined: 16 Jun 2004
Posts: 11802
Location: Sydney, NSW


 Reply with quote  

Nice job! Any thoughts about adding a 2nd, smaller motor pulley so you can use even lower speeds and higher torque?
_________________
Australian 2015 Featherweight champion
UK 2016 Gladiator champion

Post Sat Dec 20, 2014 10:45 pm 
 View user's profile Send private message
Glen
Experienced Roboteer


Joined: 16 Jun 2004
Posts: 9481
Location: Where you least expect


 Reply with quote  

Doubt it. Looks like it runs to 120hz with good torque so basing the gearing off that and considering its 3x as powerful as before, it should have enough power to run off the one gear at all speeds.

Worse case there are some cheap teco brand VFDs now that have rudimentary vector control meaning it should have near 100% torque from very very low rpm. Getting one of those would be ideal, especially for CNC Very Happy

We will see anyway Razz
_________________
www.demon50s.com - Minimoto parts
http://www.youtube.com/user/HyzerGlen - Videoooozzz

Post Sat Dec 20, 2014 11:55 pm 
 View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website MSN Messenger
Jaemus
Experienced Roboteer


Joined: 01 Apr 2009
Posts: 2674
Location: NSW


 Reply with quote  

apparently, the video is still being processed
_________________
<Patrician|Away> what does your robot do, sam
<bovril> it collects data about the surrounding environment, then discards it and drives into walls

Post Sun Dec 21, 2014 2:00 pm 
 View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail MSN Messenger
Knightrous
Site Admin


Joined: 15 Jun 2004
Posts: 8511
Location: NSW


 Reply with quote  

Make a second set of the required conversion parts and I'll buy them Razz
_________________
https://www.halfdonethings.com/

Post Mon Dec 22, 2014 7:13 am 
 View user's profile Send private message
Glen
Experienced Roboteer


Joined: 16 Jun 2004
Posts: 9481
Location: Where you least expect


 Reply with quote  

Yeah youtube locked up lol, will upload tonight!

And if ur srs bsns i can order a second set of pulleys and what not.
_________________
www.demon50s.com - Minimoto parts
http://www.youtube.com/user/HyzerGlen - Videoooozzz

Post Mon Dec 22, 2014 10:52 am 
 View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website MSN Messenger
Knightrous
Site Admin


Joined: 15 Jun 2004
Posts: 8511
Location: NSW


 Reply with quote  

Now that I'm within pissing distance of your place, I'm keen to employ your assistance do some mods to my C6 to make it that little bit more awesome. Currently just need to bring it down from QLD though Rolling Eyes
_________________
https://www.halfdonethings.com/

Post Mon Dec 22, 2014 10:54 am 
 View user's profile Send private message
Jaemus
Experienced Roboteer


Joined: 01 Apr 2009
Posts: 2674
Location: NSW


 Reply with quote  

My Czero already has a VFD so ner Razz
_________________
<Patrician|Away> what does your robot do, sam
<bovril> it collects data about the surrounding environment, then discards it and drives into walls

Post Mon Dec 22, 2014 7:41 pm 
 View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail MSN Messenger
Glen
Experienced Roboteer


Joined: 16 Jun 2004
Posts: 9481
Location: Where you least expect


 Reply with quote  

Czero, much luls! I think that's a dc drive though Razz so double nyer!

Just about finished the majority of the conversion. Need to raid jaycar tommorow for some wiring bits and wait for the main on/off buttons to show up from RS.

VFD mounts under the cabinet. The top shelf will be reserved for CNC gear Smile and boxed in with polycarb so i can't jab my fingers in there like a 'tard



The wiring to the VFD goes through standard loom tube from masters/bunnings. 4 core to the motor goes through one and the 12v control wiring and 3 core power wiring through the other. Gotta replace that IEC plug with a male version too.

Laser cut an acrylic blanking plate to replace the lathes original power plug, its the one under the tubes, which i have to say is the worst designed mains plug ever unless I am missing something. Its a two prong plug with an earth attachment, but seems specifically designed so it can be plugged in either way around so neutral and active are flipped. Why?!



Laser cut control panel for a test. Final piece will be in black acrylic. The tach is a $8 ebay job using a hall effect and magnet. Going to stick the magnet to the steel Timing pulley drive and measure off of that. I'm sure it will be good enough for the time being. That can be replaced with a proper encoder style setup when it's CNC time.

the stock reversing switch is retained, a speed pot is added and a latching off switch + momentary on switch go in the bottom.



Need to add 2x relays for the 12v no voltage release setup then that is it! friggen keen to get this all done. The thought of doing some major lathe work without the belt slipping and stalling out is drool worthy Laughing
_________________
www.demon50s.com - Minimoto parts
http://www.youtube.com/user/HyzerGlen - Videoooozzz

Post Wed Dec 31, 2014 1:29 am 
 View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website MSN Messenger
Jaemus
Experienced Roboteer


Joined: 01 Apr 2009
Posts: 2674
Location: NSW


 Reply with quote  

Yeah Czero is DC Very Happy

Looking great! Keen to see this thing fired up doing things all automagically
_________________
<Patrician|Away> what does your robot do, sam
<bovril> it collects data about the surrounding environment, then discards it and drives into walls

Post Sat Jan 03, 2015 9:12 am 
 View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail MSN Messenger
Glen
Experienced Roboteer


Joined: 16 Jun 2004
Posts: 9481
Location: Where you least expect


 Reply with quote  

Shazam! She's done (ish!)

Waiting for the pulley shop to come back from holidays then swap it to timing belts + setup the tachometer with a proper photo interrupter instead of the crap hall effect which seems wretchedly inaccurate at low speed.

Oh and redo the faceplate out of acrylic with nice engravings. Better grab some of that this week Razz

As for safety. Turns out there is no true emergency stop, however it can -sort of- be implemented by having the e-stop button trigger the overheat input, and then set your "on" button as the reset.

The only way this could be circumvented would be to leave the machine running then yank the power cord out without either turning the pot off, the reversing switch to neutral or hitting the e-stop. The VFD will go back to running after that.

I hit the e-stop as a habit now anyway so that's good enough for me Laughing

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=53QG0b29NIc&feature=youtu.be
_________________
www.demon50s.com - Minimoto parts
http://www.youtube.com/user/HyzerGlen - Videoooozzz

Post Sun Jan 04, 2015 1:09 am 
 View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website MSN Messenger
Valen
Experienced Roboteer


Joined: 07 Jul 2004
Posts: 4436
Location: Sydney


 Reply with quote  

nice
so what does the estop button do now?
_________________
Mechanical engineers build weapons, civil engineers build targets

Post Mon Jan 05, 2015 12:11 pm 
 View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger ICQ Number
marto
Experienced Roboteer


Joined: 08 Jul 2004
Posts: 5459
Location: Brisbane, QLD


 Reply with quote  

Very nice.

With that gear ratio setup you will never need to change gears again.
_________________
Steven Martin
Twisted Constructions
http://www.botbitz.com

Post Mon Jan 05, 2015 1:01 pm 
 View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail MSN Messenger
Glen
Experienced Roboteer


Joined: 16 Jun 2004
Posts: 9481
Location: Where you least expect


 Reply with quote  

It puts the vfd into shutdown by enabling the overheat input (its pd0044 or something), then you have to reset it with the reset/on button to make it run again.

+ Indeed. Will have 3x more actual gearing on top of running the motor to 100hz roughly. So much power!
_________________
www.demon50s.com - Minimoto parts
http://www.youtube.com/user/HyzerGlen - Videoooozzz

Post Mon Jan 05, 2015 1:19 pm 
 View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website MSN Messenger
Glen
Experienced Roboteer


Joined: 16 Jun 2004
Posts: 9481
Location: Where you least expect


 Reply with quote  

They're selling the motor i used again -

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Electric-motor-Three-phase-415v-1-1kw-1-5HP-2800rpm-shaft-19mm-/181695344357
_________________
www.demon50s.com - Minimoto parts
http://www.youtube.com/user/HyzerGlen - Videoooozzz

Post Mon Apr 20, 2015 2:09 am 
 View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website MSN Messenger
  Display posts from previous:      

Forum Jump:
Jump to:  

Post new topic   Reply to topic
Page 1 of 2

Goto page 1, 2  Next

Forum Rules:
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum

 

Last Thread | Next Thread  >
Powered by phpBB: © 2001 phpBB Group
millenniumFalcon Template By Vereor.