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Arena Standards
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Spockie-Tech
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Joined: 31 May 2004
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Location: Melbourne, Australia


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quote:
Originally posted by maddox:
Can I quote you on the FRA forum Spockie Tech?



You can if you like, but that comment wasnt specifically aimed at the FRA. I havent followed what they're up to at all, to say whether it applies in this case or not..

Its a general observation of many clubs and other "organisations" I have participated in over the years as my interests evolve - whether its Cars, Gyrocopters, Computers, Helicopters, Go Karts or whatever.. the problem remains the same.

Most of the club members arent interested in filling the administrative positions.. they are in whatever the sport is to have fun, not push papers.. so you end up with the paper-pushing-committee-positions being occupied by people who are either forced into it, or by people who like the "authority" position.

After a while, the position becomes attractive to them and they start to play political games to keep it and flex their authoritive muscle, which alienates them from the people who "just want to ____ <whatever the club is about"

My thought is.. Dont give people a political arena to play in, and the only way for them to gain the admiration of their peers is to do well in the objective of the sport.. in this case.. the Combat Arena.. Wink
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Post Tue Jan 23, 2007 9:34 am 
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DumHed
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same thing as government of countries really!
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Post Tue Jan 23, 2007 9:54 am 
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Daniel
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Joined: 30 Aug 2005
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Wow, I just got a talking to on the FRA forum.


quote:
RE Daniel (see archive): Your axe head may not be capable of breaking through a roof, but if it were hit by a spinner then it could. A tether minimises that risk as much as possible.



quote:
RE Ed (see archive): So this tether thing is only if my weapon clashes with a spinner. But if there arn't any spinners I won't need the tether.
Also I am having touble trying to come up with a way to make a tether that could survive if the axe is damaged by a spinner. Anything the rips the axe from the robot will more then likely rip the tether off too. I have a one peice blade that I some times use for an axe, which is directly attached to the axial. The only way to rip it out of the robot is to remove half the robot with it. A tether in this case seems useless, just another reason to add weight to a robot.
I am more likely to have my armor and wheels ripped off by a spinner, should I be tethering them aswell?
I understand some people might be only concerned with an axe on spinner clash, but don't we a) design for that so of impact, I do which is why I have the one peice blade, and b) you've just banned spinners, so why hinder axes as well?

How about a simple solution. We make is compulsery that spinners have to tether their teeth.


Ok, I might have been a little sarcastic, but I was just testing them a bit.


quote:
Dainel, the tether rule is there to comply with the rule you must have a tether of some kind. If you have a one piece shaft and head then I would assume that the shaft/head must be tethered to the robot chassis. This would satisfy the rule to my standards. If the rule is there you build to it, it stops arguments such as this happening at events by one competitor saying "oh he hasn't got a tether" for example.
As for your last statement, at the last event an tooth was ripped off but it was the bar that failed not the tooth itself so a tether wouldn't have had any effect.
THz tether is very good, if the head or shaft breaks then it is tethered at any point. I am sure that at that point John would stop firing the axe as it is more likely to damage his machine.
Sorry got carried away, nuff said.


quote:
Let me just say that the new guidlines havent been hastley put together. As andy said they have been worked on ever scince the UK Champs.

The thing is its not just a little risky to run events to the old standard, but highly risky to the point we are very lucky somebody hasnt got seriously hurt or killed. Thats fact.
These new guildlines are extremely important and all agreed, they needed to be in place immediately

Post Tue Jan 23, 2007 10:43 am 
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maddox



Joined: 21 Dec 2006
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Location: Belgium


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Sarcastic Daniel?



quote:
Daniel, the tether rule is not that difficult nor effective. No dimensions nor anchor points are mandated. A tether on your axe could be a badstop chain connected to a self tapping screw on a 3mm polycarb plate.

Also, if I recall correctly, it is a safety device, and not counted into the weight of the robot. So, if your drive/chassis is strong enough, why not using a anchor chain of 5 kg per link? Your 13.6kg machine with 50kg of "safety device"... talk about grip and pushing capability then.


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Post Tue Jan 23, 2007 5:59 pm 
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Valen
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mmm Li-po "saftey chain"
done and done
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Post Tue Jan 23, 2007 7:14 pm 
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Woody



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"No dimensions nor anchor points are mandated" ...... Be fair Mario it's an almost impossible task for someone to write a ruleset to cover every type and variation of construction.
I suspect that the tether rule will be worded in such a way as to make the builder responsible for it's suitability for the task.

Post Tue Jan 23, 2007 7:14 pm 
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Knightrous
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quote:
A tether on your axe could be a badstop chain connected to a self tapping screw on a 3mm polycarb plate.


If the axe/hammer has just been torn off, who would honestly think a "self tapping screw on a 3mm polycarb plate" is going to hold? If Jolt just accelerated your 1kg hammer head to 250km/h, I think that little self tapper is screwed... Rolling Eyes
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Post Tue Jan 23, 2007 7:29 pm 
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Rotwang
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I am a little curious as to the situation where a tether is severed in a fight but the bot is otherwise undamaged.

Can you continue to use your weapon or are you disqualified if you knowingly fire your axe.

Seems stupid to me, a VD can launch chunks of bots into the arena roof, you cant tether everything.

The arena should be up to any eventuality.
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Post Tue Jan 23, 2007 7:40 pm 
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Woody



Joined: 07 Oct 2004
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quote:
The arena should be up to any eventuality.


Sadly the cost for upgrading some of the current arena's to the new spec is prohibative.

quote:

Here's some suggested specs from America curtest of Steven Kirk Nelson (SLAMER) Team K.I.S.S.

If I was to build an arena for say 30-60 lbs I would us at least one sheet of 1/2 inch lexan for the first four feet of arena wall up from the floor and the same for the roof. Especially if you allow vertical spinning weapons. For any machine larger than that you really need about 1 inch "basically two sheets of 1/2 inch of lexan" and again you have to make a strong Steel baricade to keep the weapons from ever hitting the Lexan walls and you need a full roof made from at least 1/2 in thick Lexan. Less than this and your really asking for trouble. Lexan is pretty exspensive stuff alright, but it's cheaper than repairing broken humans



Woody

Last edited by Woody on Tue Jan 23, 2007 8:23 pm; edited 1 time in total

Post Tue Jan 23, 2007 8:19 pm 
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Valen
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thats some creative ass covering there.
"its up to the builder to make sure its suitablle"
how does one test this?

well if it gets hit and breaks then its not suitable.

Thus your going to need 8mm steel cable minimum.
then your going to attach that to pretty much every component in your bot so that when the end is ripped off your whole bot goes with it.

hmmm i spose all bots should be tethered to the floor if there is a high powered flipper.
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Post Tue Jan 23, 2007 8:22 pm 
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Woody



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quote:
Thats some creative ass covering there. "its up to the builder to make sure its suitablle"


You expect the EO to take responsibilty for any "accidents"?

Bots are getting better and more destructive .... and the cost of building and running an insurable arena rises... I believe that the FRA are merely trying to keep the sport alive.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insurable_risk

Post Tue Jan 23, 2007 8:29 pm 
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Rotwang
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Once again being relative latecomers to robot combat works to our advantage in that our main class is the 30lb feathers.

We have a few 60 lb lightweights but they are not allowed spinning weapons and they are not being pushed as a class as in no prize money and relegated to status of exhibition or filler matches.
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Post Tue Jan 23, 2007 8:55 pm 
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kkeerroo
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For Australian arena builders: Why not use that corrugated polycarb roofing material? I tis designed to have hailstones bounce off it so it must be better than that shade cloth.

For the rest: Isn't the axe head tethered by the shaft or handle? Or the axle?
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Post Tue Jan 23, 2007 9:33 pm 
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assassin



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quote:
Originally posted by kkeerroo:
For Australian arena builders: Why not use that corrugated polycarb roofing material? I tis designed to have hailstones bounce off it so it must be better than that shade cloth.



Yes I have thought the same, it has been on sale @ bunnings.
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Post Tue Jan 23, 2007 9:41 pm 
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Nick
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quote:
If Jolt just accelerated your 1kg hammer head to 250km/h, I think that little self tapper is screwed...


Laughing I did the maths last year and Jolt's tip speed is a fraction under 100KMH. If you recall, when I fought Bane in Brisbane, I ripped the axe head right off but it barely got above floor level. Jolt's teeth are another thing, one whacked into the Marayong front wall at head height last year - it hardly left a mark on the polycarb Smile

Can anyone see the time when the FRA wants a tether on all parts of a spinner weapon? From an engineering POV, it would be far safer and more predictable to just upgrade the arena. That is one testable fix rather than 20 or 30 seperate solutions, all built to different standards and not really testable. Let's NOt bother with that regulation![/quote]
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Post Tue Jan 23, 2007 9:58 pm 
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