Well me and 3 friends are building a bot.
My dad is making us a ESC he said it cake and it should cost $300 he said no more than $50. But anyway we are not sure what to make a Lightweight or a Feather weight (it is our first bot) we live in QLD and we are wondering what has more compition.

Ok now to the flipper part

How should we make it?

I herd CO2 is a bit annoying to deal with.
Someone told me a bike pump and coke bottles (no clue how it would really work seems like only 1 blow chance)

My dad said mabye we should use highdrolics any thoughts?

and are drill motors strong unof for somthing 13-27kg?

!!!sorry for poor spelling!!!

I don't want to be an ass, but please, watch this: http://www.starterupsteve.com/swf/posting.html

Please use search functions and check out some other threads related roughly to your queries before starting new topics. Some of us have been in this community for 5+ years, the amount of newcomers who slap up "OMFG, WTF is the beessstt moter?" threads really don't make it enjoyable to answer several times...

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But anyway we are not sure what to make a Lightweight or a Feather weight (it is our first bot) we live in QLD and we are wondering what has more compition.

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quote:

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Ok now to the flipper part Smile
How should we make it?

I herd CO2 is a bit annoying to deal with.
Someone told me a bike pump and coke bottles (no clue how it would really work seems like only 1 blow chance)

My dad said mabye we should use highdrolics any thoughts?

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Most of us build featherweights in QLD. That is 13.6 kg.

I use CO2 and it is easy. I would be happy to show you how mine works at the next meet, if you and your dad come along.

Drills are a great option for featherweights.

I don't know anything about hydraulics in a robot.

Good luck.
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So even the rain that falls isn't actually going to fill our dams and our river systems

thank you for your help ill pm you in just a sec

Hello Josip,

As from far away Europe, I can give some advice. But that's about it.

Over here we have 4 weightclasses with more than 3 competitors. The heavyweights of 100kg. The 12 kg (not 13.6kg) Featherweigths, the newer, and mostely German 6 Kg raptors. And as last, but not least, and gram for gram most expensive and destructive robots, the 150 gram antweights.


Now, for a flipper, forget cokebottles and bikepumps. Those are for the " cadet or Rex Garrod-of Cassius II and Recyclops fame- RRC class kindergarden class robots".
An avarage flipper has at least 400 kg of force on a fast acting ram. This can be achieved with a very ingenous low pressure- meaning commercialy available stuff- or with an unregulated CO2 powered system.

Hydraulics. Currently, there is only 1 robot in progress in a weightclass lower than a 100 kg heavyweigth with a slow, but 5 ton powerfull crusher in "Razer style", the Dutch 12 kg Pressure.

A few more of these monsters are in development. But all have 1 thing in common. Mail, msn or PM me to know more.

What I would say. Build a 13.6 kg feather.
You will need to buy basic stuff.
But RX/TX is the thing that you can use the most, and easiest outside RW. Don't try to buy a 15th hand set from the dark ages. Buy it new.
And currently, the US Spectrum DX6 with BR6000 reciever is the best buy for the money. The low US$ helps in that respect.

For the rest, read the forum, ask questions- but use the PM function for questions you feel that could be seen as " Oh No, again ".
I'm, even after 6 years actively roboteering, not averse to answer questions. But I have to say "sorry" if I answer rather cynicaly on certain questions if it comes to money.

Congratulations on deciding to start your first bot.

(Actually I started writing this a few hours ago ago, but didnt get to finish it before I got sidetracked and I see a heap of people have jumped in first

You might want to aim for something a little more modest to start with though, unless you have an unlimited budget. How old are you, and what is your skill background ?

If you have to ask "how should we make the flipper", you probably have a lot to learn first.. never fear, everyone has to start somewhere - your best bet is to visit an event/ builders meeting and talk with some of the experienced builders in person to get an idea of what to aim for as a reasonable expectation to start with.

If your dad isnt an electronic engineer with experience in power electronics, forget about making your own ESC .

Seriously (like Aaron said). Its been tried by about 5000 robot builders around the world when they see what good ESC's cost and they think "Surely I can do it cheaper myself !"

Guess how many of them have worked reliably enough to win a serious competition ? *None*

I *am* a qualified electronic engineer, and even I found myself learning intricate subtleties of power electronics I had never even realised existed before to design and understand the already-mostly-designed-for-me (based on the OSMC) IBC Controller.

If "At high currents, minismising transiition times of Mosfets is critical and is determined by the peak current capability of the drivers ability to rapidly transfer charge to the gate capacitance whilst minimising ringing (and other effects associated with rapidly changing a capacitors charge level), *and* these transisitons must be perfectly synchronised (within nanoseconds) to avoid destructive H-Bridge shoot through" sounds like complete gobbledegook to you (or him), believe me, you wont manage it.

Save yourself some heartache and go for servo switches if the budget is tight, or do the smart thing and buy a real ESC. If you dont, you'll spend 6 months to a year making lots of magic smoke, costing yourself more and end up giving up or buying one in the long run - I guarantee it.

Drill Motors are powerful but fragile and use lots of battery power - you will need good batteries if you go for them. For a feather, 2 drills will do it if they are good ones, for a lightweight (27kg), you would want 4 as a minimum, which means a stronger Speed Controller is required as well)

Scooter motors are a lot more reliable and use less power, but are much heavier and you have to be careful with the weight of the rest of the bot, or you wont have enough for a weapon and armour

CO2 powered flippers are *very* dangerous. If someone on your team does not have experience with high pressure pneumatics, then you probably shouldnt try to do it with your first bot. It takes a lot of care and knowledge to use this violent power source safely - It is one step down from playing with explosives in terms of instant mayhem and injury potential.

Sorry to sound a bit negative, but a CO2 powered bot running a home made speed controller in the hands of a novice sounds like danger, trouble and frustration to me.

An electric powered Lifting wedge (like Vincent) is probably a better starting point unless you like diving in the deep end and have lots of money to spend.
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Great minds discuss ideas. Average minds discuss events. Small minds discuss people

Thanks for that info.

I am 15.
I have awsome welding skills and stuff.
My budget is around $500-$600


Ill show my dad that IBC controller to see if he thinks he can do.

He is a Electronic engineer with 20+ years of experience.

If you want to have a look at some pneumatic parts or or other robot bit you are welcome to visit our place. I think I even saw some home made controllers in a box downstairs. If you give us enough warning we can get a few other builders around here too.

If he knows his way around big mosfets and micro controllers, then he could probably build his own from the IBC circuit diagrams (they are in the user manual PDF at the bottom of the store page on the robowars home page).

However, the components might surprise you with just how expensive they are. Add up the High power Mosfets, Heatsinks, Microcontrollers, H-Bridge Driver chips, Servo Leads, Tranzorbs, regulators etc etc and you be up over $200 before you know it. Then you need a circuit board, a programmer for the micro (the code is available free), and hours of assembly and testing.

He might enjoy the experience of doing it himself, just be nice to him while he irons out the bugs - Powerful ESC's are quite an art in electronics. B-)

Have a look for the "speed controllers" thread on here somewhere in the tech chat section for more info.

$500-$600 is pretty tight. By the time you buy a decent radio and a good battery charger, you will have blown most of that. Add in a speed controller and some good battery packs (you will need more than 1 to compete), and you are heading for $800-$1000 without too much trouble.

Fortunately the expensive parts usually dont get damaged in a fight (provided you dont plug anything in backwards - use polarised (cant be plugged in backwards) connectors on *everything* to do with power, batteries, ESC etc. - and the radio and battery charger can be used for other radio control hobbies if you are interested.

The rest of the bot isnt too expensive, as long as you dont want waterjet cut titanium parts, or mag motors, then a couple of hundred dollars should see you through the frame, drive motors, bearings, wheels, wiring, relays etc.
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Great minds discuss ideas. Average minds discuss events. Small minds discuss people

Me and my dad wore talking for a bit he said he could take that chip board and get it made for $50 and and his own parts and he said that is nothing great and he can make lots better

He even is thinking if he makes it right he will sell so could be good for the robotics community

We have a new plan for a robot (SECRET)

It will be almost to pick it up so watch out people

i dont meen to sound rude or arrogant by this but im not sure he knows what his getting himself in for, though if he can indeed do it than thats great and perhaps after its been battle proven it might just become the new standard of robot control but i am doubious to it all in all... but best of luck in all to it
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as a shadow is seen and not heard i am here
-Waddy the phoenix

Ah, the infamous "Newbiew Secret Robot Design" syndrome

Sorry, it wont work, most of our robots are quite immune to repeated blasts of hot air

If your dad can build a "Better than IBC for $50 ESC, please allow me to be the first place to place an order for 10 units right now.. When can I take delivery ?

The IBC design is over 4 years old now, so it probably can be made better - it could use some current limiting, an extra RC channel for Flip, an on board weapons relay and a more sophisticated micro with ramping and a few other tweaks, but all these ideas make it more expensive, not cheaper.

If your dad thinks he can do it better AND cheaper, then the third corner of the production triangle (time) will probably apply and it will be years off before he gets it finished.

Please, prove me wrong, It would be a great thing for the builders to have a more economical and better controller available to buy.

I realise that combat involves a certain amount of chest-thumping and boasting, but remember you're doing it amongst people who have years of experience here.. carry it too far and you'll just sound like a wanna-be..

Eat some humble pie and you might learn something from us instead of making us laugh at you.
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Great minds discuss ideas. Average minds discuss events. Small minds discuss people

Funny that you mention Vincent in your post, Brett. It's one of the only robots running a home built speed controller
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They say that he crossed the fine line, from insanity to genius.

Yeah, and Vincent took a long time to get where it did with it's prototype controller, and still, it's just a BANG BANG controller, none of that fancy PWM stuff like in the Pulse 50's you've built
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https://www.halfdonethings.com/

DIY ESC is not easy, For our one we have spent about $500 on parts alone so far and its not finished yet. With the lessons we have learnt in building this one we have changed the design for version 2 to the point its basically a new project. Your not going to make something that will push ~50A though 2 motors for $50 first time round.
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Mechanical engineers build weapons, civil engineers build targets