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Speed controler info
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timmeh
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Joined: 20 Jul 2004
Posts: 2523
Location: Victoria


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Speed controler info

Was looking at the team delta web site yest and noticed that they clame the victor 883's are 80 amps continious so i emailed them asking why they say they are 80 amps and the market place say they are 60 amps and this is what i got back>

I was selling the Victors long before he was, so I should know... not to
mention I've worked on and off for IFI for 3 years.

So there ya go i just thought you would like to know and allso this thread could be used to post new info on controlers and things.
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Post Mon Apr 11, 2005 4:19 pm 
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Knightrous
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Joined: 15 Jun 2004
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Location: NSW


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Well, I know lately, Dan Danknick from Team Delta (Hazard) has shifted out of the combat robot side of things into Tetsujin robots.

I've heard some rumours he's sour grapes now after losing his last Battlebots championship with Hazard against T-Minus. But don't class that as law. I only believe he's got a thing against Jim and wants your to buy them from him...

*Senses some flaming*
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Post Mon Apr 11, 2005 5:22 pm 
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Spockie-Tech
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Location: Melbourne, Australia


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The Victors are a little under-rated In my opinion compared to most ESC's.

The have 3 un-heatsinked, but fan-cooled FETs which depending on the Fet-Specs I would probably put more around the 80-90 amps area, so Dan (Team Delta's comment) is probably right.

(Tip, dont play Dan (Team Delta) and Jim (Robot Market Place) off against each other, I get the feeling they're basically in competition with each other and dont like it)

I wouldnt expect them to handle high peaks very well though, since they have no "thermal mass" heatsink to dump heat into quickly, (air can only absorb a limited amount of heat), which is probably why they go a bit conservative on the rating and call it a 60amp controller when compared to other manufacturers who use heatsinks to improve the surge-handling...

About the only ESC manufacturer that rates their controllers in *real* continuous amps is Vantec. The rest of the ESC's that are intended for Combat Bot use (short duration, high intensity) tend to use more of a "averaged power" specification.
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Post Mon Apr 11, 2005 5:24 pm 
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timmeh
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Joined: 20 Jul 2004
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Location: Victoria


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So would it be safe to use a 80 amp breaker on each channel if i was to use larger drill motor?

Or is that an unanswerable?
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Post Mon Apr 11, 2005 5:24 pm 
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kkeerroo
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Joined: 17 Jun 2004
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Location: Brisbane


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In Hellbringer I run two 12v drill motors (mabuchi 550) in parrallel off a 24v Battle pack through a victor 883 for each side of the robot. At Melbourne I simultainiously melted the brush mounting springs in 3 of the motors and left the battery too hot to touch. Since my battery can only supply a maximum of 90ish amps each speedo had an estimated peak current of over 40 amps passing through them.
So before people start going on about circuit-breakers (Where can you get 80A circuit-breakers from?) you should have a look at your battery specs to see exactly how much current they can supply (And here Aaron will come in saying his Doss batteries can supply umpteen thousand amps without being able to provide any real evidence).
Personaly I like the victors. Simple and easy to use without any un-needed "features".
But discussions on speed controllers sound a lot like a discussion between Ford and Holden fans.
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Post Tue Apr 12, 2005 7:13 am 
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Philip
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Joined: 18 Jun 2004
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Location: Queensland near Brisbane


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I am happy with my 30A Electronize speedos. They remain cool even when my batteries and motor get hot in a stall situation. They are used with bots that run two drills in parrallel in the UK.

Here are some details pasted from Electronize.

Features



Standard radio control servo signal input. (standard connector supplied)

Smooth P.W.M. forward and reverse speed control.

Selectable operating mode.


Low frequency mode: 100Hz


Variable frequency mode: 10 to 1000Hz


High frequency mode: 2000Hz

Low loss Power MOSFET current switching. (Only 2.3 milli-Ohms)

Low loss heavy duty cables. (0.25mm2)

High current automotive relays designed specifically for high power motor control.

Precision pre-set neutral.

Adjustable speed range to match throttle stick travel or scale speed.

6 to 24 volt motor battery operation.

30 amp. continuous load rating in either direction.

90 amp. short term stall rating. (continuous MOSFET rating)*

360 amp. peak rating.



*Beware suppliers who quote MOSFET rating as continuous controller rating!
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Post Tue Apr 12, 2005 10:21 am 
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Spockie-Tech
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Funnily enough, I quite like the look of the Electronize's as well.. (see, I'm not just an IBC Salesman. Razz

I think they'd probably be a good cheap alternative for a beginning builder to get their bot moving.. Can you tell us what they actually cost each when you get them to Australian Philip ?

I suspect the various PicAxe-based relay controllers (with mosfet speed control) that are under intermittent development by myself, Ajax, moth and Aaron are all going to end up being very like an Electronize in the end.

How do you do your mixing (In the Transmitter ?) or with an external board ? and what do you use for a weapon control ?
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Post Tue Apr 12, 2005 11:56 am 
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timmeh
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Joined: 20 Jul 2004
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Location: Victoria


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quote:
Originally posted by kkeerroo:

So before people start going on about circuit-breakers (Where can you get 80A circuit-breakers from?) you should have a look at your battery specs to see exactly how much current they can supply (And here Aaron will come in saying his Doss batteries can supply umpteen thousand amps without being able to provide any real evidence)


I use 3600 nicads and they are suposed to give 80 amps.

But before people start saying well i wont kneed a 80 amp breaker cos the batts can only give 80amps well i blew a track on the ibc and IIRC brett sed you knees like 120 amps or something to do so.

I sent dan another email saying>So the fetts are 80 amp fetts but they say they are 60amp to be safe or something?

And his reply was>With the fan cooling, they're good for even more than 80 but that's a safe operating area.

So if i understood him correctly with fan cooling they can handle 80 contin and they can take eaven more then 80 but 80 is the safe mark with fan cooling.
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Post Tue Apr 12, 2005 4:06 pm 
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Spockie-Tech
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Quality NiCd Cells can supply momentary peaks over 100amps.

They might only *sustain* 60-80 amps, but the high current sanyo's (Especially the C size as opposed to the Sub-C's) would easily put out enugh current to fry a track off the board.

You can buy Thermal-Reset Circuit breakers up to about 50 amps easily (and cheaply) enough from Bursons/Repco pretty cheaply. If you really want 80amps and they dont go that big, you could try two in parallel.
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Post Tue Apr 12, 2005 4:16 pm 
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Knightrous
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Bring your amp meter and a victor and I'll blow it up for you with one of my Doss batteries on the starter motor Smile (Only 400amps for 1-2 secs by the way Razz)
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Post Tue Apr 12, 2005 6:23 pm 
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Philip
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Joined: 18 Jun 2004
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Location: Queensland near Brisbane


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quote:
Originally posted by Spockie-Tech:
Funnily enough, I quite like the look of the Electronize's as well.. (see, I'm not just an IBC Salesman. Razz

I think they'd probably be a good cheap alternative for a beginning builder to get their bot moving.. Can you tell us what they actually cost each when you get them to Australian Philip ?


I have seen you suggest the Electronize before. I know that you are into the IBC for the good of the sport and not to make a million, Brett.

I bought two 30 A Electronize speedos, one 10 A two way RC relay (for the weapon) and one mixer. The entire package was AU$285 including postage from the UK.

The Electronize do not have the flip function of the IBC and each unit is seperate as opposed to the single board of the IBC.
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Post Tue Apr 12, 2005 6:58 pm 
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Ali



Joined: 06 Mar 2005
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Im living in the uk right now . If more people were interested in the Electronize i could make up a bulk buy order .
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Post Wed Apr 13, 2005 1:57 am 
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Spockie-Tech
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Actually, something I just realised if I may indulge in a bit of self-congratualtion.. Cool

The Number 1 ranked Robot in Australia at the moment ? Cobra - IBC Powered
The Winner of RoboWars 1 ? - Mouse - IBC Powered
The Winner of RoboWars 2 ? - Plan B - IBC Powered
The Winner of the Marayong Annihlator ? Mini-Mower - IBC Powered
70% of the Robots in the current top 10 ? - IBC Powered

I'm not sure about the Queensland winner history, but I know that most of the Vertex Bots are IBC powered too, so I guess the results are similair..

Pretty good going for the cheapest all-in-one ESC out there huh ?

OK, Ok.. (I just realised and thought I'd tell you all)
[/boast mode off]
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Last edited by Spockie-Tech on Sat Apr 16, 2005 11:34 am; edited 1 time in total

Post Sat Apr 16, 2005 1:51 am 
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Knightrous
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MM2 winner Mite-e-er is IBC powered
MM3 winner Marauder is Electronise powered
MM4 winner Cheese Shredder is IBC powered
MM5/HOC1 winner Vertical Limits is IBC powered
HOC2 winner Scarifer(I've spelt that wrong Confused ) is Victor powered
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Post Sat Apr 16, 2005 10:18 am 
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dyrodium
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Yes, but the marayong winner from 2004 was sorry: microswitch powered... Smile
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Post Sat Apr 16, 2005 11:26 am 
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